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Thread: Russia & China could set international gold price based on physical gold trading

  1. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by SnakeEater View Post
    BTC and crypto is not perfect YET and it is the first competition of zero intrinsic values digit. The fiat with zero intrinsic values is charging "transaction fee" to keep numbers safe but not the values.

    All fiat banks does not create values but create numbers. The effort to create numbers is too easy and creating 10 trillion to mine the asteroids is easy. But to distribute the values fairly is a financial war.

    BTC and crypto should remain as a free numbers contract but same as fiat, there is no guarantee of values. The same with all online purchase and commerce the values will never be a fair trade.

    I foresee a gold/silver demands from physical forms as a true offgrid money. As the wildly created digits is possibly reaching millions of quadrillions, Gold price of 1 million/oz is possible unless Gold mine increase output by million times where every human on Earth own 100kg of Gold which is about 1 billion tonnes Gold. Today official number is too low at 187,000 tonnes which give each person 1 oz Gold only.
    intrinsic value is subjective.
    that's why many took the chocolate bar over a gold or silver bar
    Last edited by yellowsnow; 01-03-2018 at 03:51 PM.

  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by yellowsnow View Post
    the problem with gold backed credit system is the trustworthiness of the custodian of the gold.. Can u guarantee that Goldmoney who is holding your gold won't get hacked or be un-corrupted forever? with crypto, the governance is built in. Goldmoney is still a 3rd party holding your gold. At least with crypto, you the only one who can access it.
    The world was gold-backed for 1000s of years. Goldmoney is akin to a bank. My gold is held in private storage in different locations around the world within vaults of different companies: Loomis, Brinks, etc. Many companies who sell precious metals offer this service. Goldmoney, however, has the credit card. Additionally, the blockchain is being integrated into gold currently from what I have heard.

    As far as cryptos, cryptos have been hacked. They already cannot be trusted. They have split, they have forked, they added and diluted. It's a lot easier to add a zero to a crypto than it is to organize theft of physical gold from a well-defended vault. If you lose your cryptos, there is no insurance, nothing, they are simply gone. Your entire wealth...gondo.
    Last edited by surfsup; 01-03-2018 at 03:57 PM.

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by surfsup View Post
    The world was gold-backed for 1000s of years. Goldmoney is akin to a bank. My gold is held in private storage in different locations around the world within vaults of different companies: Loomis, Brinks, etc.

    Cryptos HAVE been hacked. They already cannot be trusted. They have split, they have forked, they added and diluted. It's a lot easier to add a zero to a crypto than it is to organize theft of physical gold from a well-defended vault.
    so you own gold because you don't trust banks but you trust a gold bank?

    Gold is mined continuously (dilution)
    Gold can be faked and robbed

    Those forked bitcoins are NOT real bitcoin, they just borrowing bitcoin name for branding.

    btc is held by private key stored in servers around the world.

    Can silver, platinum, palladium, rhodium be considered forked precious metal of gold?
    Last edited by yellowsnow; 01-03-2018 at 04:03 PM.

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by yellowsnow View Post
    so you own gold because you don't trust banks but you trust a gold bank?
    What??? Did you not read what I wrote?

    Gold is mined continuously (dilution)
    Totally different to dig up finite amounts that are relatively known year to year vs adding zeros. I don't think you get it.

    Gold can be faked and robbed
    gold cannot be faked. People can be fooled, but you cannot fake gold.
    Gold can be robbed but so can anything. More easy to rob bitcoin. You can do it from the other side of the planet.

    Those forked bitcoins are NOT real bitcoin, they just borrowing bitcoin name for branding.
    As evidenced by your lack of knowledge here in this discussion, you are incorrect.

    btc is held by private key stored in servers around the world.
    so what? a network cable connected to my PC I am typing on is connected to every bitcoin on the planet - as evidenced by the constant crypto hacking

    Can silver, platinum, palladium, rhodium be considered forked precious metal of gold?
    Huh?

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by yellowsnow View Post
    We had a nice, long thread on this topic, with all parties independently concluding that "intrinsic value means what I think it means", which was erroneous in most of the cases.

    Sorry yellowsnow, but this one could be included in the majority.

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by AnotherDave View Post
    We had a nice, long thread on this topic, with all parties independently concluding that "intrinsic value means what I think it means", which was erroneous in most of the cases.

    Sorry yellowsnow, but this one could be included in the majority.
    The intrinsic value of the Phillips Head Screwdriver resides within its design but without the Phillips Head Screw, it is (almost) worthless - aside from punching a hole in something (which can well be accomplished by any pointy object). I'd rather be a hammer than a nail....yes I would....if I only couuuuld. I surely wouuuld!
    Who are the righteous?

    Those who cannot articulate the other argument do not fully understand their own.

    "Man Makes Himself"........V. Gordon Childe

    "Much can be done by wise legislation and by resolute enforcement of the law. But still much more must be done
    by steady training of the individual. in conscience and character...." .......TR The wisdom is knowing which is when...MarkPTI

    Militia

  7. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by surfsup View Post
    6) Confidence: or should I say gullibility? There is no actual confidence BTC can be used as money. A coupon? Sure. But not money. BTC trades as an investment, not money. The moment it is generally perceived the runup is over, imo it will crash to zero. Who wants to own something they don't feel they can sell at a higher price later?
    Looks like I was correct and the shift is starting. Kodak announces the first blockchain coupon called KodakOne. What is it? A coupon to compensate individual photographers for their work. RIP vaporcoins like bitcoin. As I stated earlier there is no limit to cryptos being issued. However, they will be issued as coupons by private companies offering some sort of compensation backing. We see this with Kodak.

    Additionally, I was right about another point, that gold and silver will eventually be the tie to the blockchain and a crypto that will be used as money, not a coupon. We have a gold-backed crypto being accepted for real-estate payment in Mumbai. This I would call money because it is backed by gold, with likely less volatility since it is backed by gold, but the astute seller will likely convert it immediately.

    Word on the street is a UK gold-backed crypto will emerge backed by the government of England. France is also supposedly coming up with a new currency that will be valued at a ratio of pre and post Euro-debt. Stuff is getting crazy but gold is still held by world governments and while we don't like them much, we all need governments to do governmental things in our respective countries.

    So, in my opinion, vaporcoin owners should start seeing these things become more prevalent, and it will increase selling pressure on non-backed vaporcoins. Since the trend I describe is just starting, I think this trend of coupon cryptocurrencies (CCCs) and metals-backed cryptocurrencies (MBCCs) will gain a lot of strength over the next 5 years and produce a magnanimous, unrelenting pressure on vaporcoins. Good luck out there guys and hope everyone, including me, can stay above water. Things are moving fast!

  8. #28

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    ...aaaaaand more news on the Petro, another asset-backed crypto (ABC) rather than a vaporcoin like bitcoin etal

    https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-N...n-6-Weeks.html

    Each Petro to be backed by a barrel of oil. Personally I think this is going to be hacking dream for foreign governments, but what do I know? Regardless, the vaporcoins continue to see pressure from ABCs that have a physical backing. Why would anyone buy a vaporcoin when they can get an ABC?

  9. #29
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    Thanks for the link surfsup. I believe there are plenty of reasons to buy/trade/hold Bitcoin and other non-asset based cryptocurrencies. Many good business models. Of course there are loads of bad business models in the space as well as outright frauds and scams.

    Quote Originally Posted by surfsup View Post
    ...Why would anyone buy a vaporcoin when they can get an ABC?
    This part of your post remids me of https://www.cbsnews.com/news/bitcoin...ptocurrencies/ fast forward to 1:40 for the relative part

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by AnotherDave View Post
    Price! Price! Price! You are all assuming Price! in terms of fiat; pricing gold, something that exists--and can be measured--in terms of something that is imaginary, can't be counted, and is highly controlled.

    You don't have to be a rocket surgeon to figure out how this will end.
    I would like to assert that we all know the Oil/USD/Gold trade does not need USD, therefore oil/gold is the (value for value) trade which defines the price. There is as little value in USD as there is in Bitcoin, its a transient transnational medium without any long term fundamentals.

    For example http://www.macrotrends.net/1380/gold...storical-chart
    Last edited by ILTim; 01-17-2018 at 11:12 AM.

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