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Thread: Platinum mining supply to run out in 15 years?

  1. #1

    Default Platinum mining supply to run out in 15 years?

    That's what this article predicts: http://www.bbc.com/future/story/2014...rcest-material

    But then again, for how long have they been saying oil would run out? If, however, there is any substance to this article -- you would think platinum would not have dived so far. 15 years is nothing. Will the metals as discussed in this article no longer have affordable sources to mine -- or will new methods be developed, or alternatives, such that a great increase in value will never happen?

    Anyone with greater knowledge on the mining industry has an opinion about this?

    If the end of production is a likely possibility, and population increased such that demand for basic product only increases, I just don't get how cost in cheap fiat could have declined so far over the last 5 years. We are either fools for not buying up more at "sale" fiat prices, or everyone who talks about peak this or that, simply has no idea about mining the commodity they are talking about, or the public's need for such metals.
    “Of all the contrivances for cheating the laboring class of mankind, none has been more effective than that which deludes them with paper money.”Daniel Webster (1782-1852)

  2. #2

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhodium9000 View Post
    Yes indeed. Do you have any opinion on platinum coming from the ground (or asteroids) at affordable prices running out at any time frame?

    Also, given your name, what about Rhodium? So low now, what are the chances of significantly less value, vs popping up? Don't here ANYTHING about Rhodium anymore -- do not understand how such big spikes could ever happen as it did almost to 10K -- if people could have just stored the stuff for cheap. Or was everyone really so clueless, nobody thought of having any reserves?
    “Of all the contrivances for cheating the laboring class of mankind, none has been more effective than that which deludes them with paper money.”Daniel Webster (1782-1852)

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by motocat View Post
    Yes indeed. Do you have any opinion on platinum coming from the ground (or asteroids) at affordable prices running out at any time frame?

    Also, given your name, what about Rhodium? So low now, what are the chances of significantly less value, vs popping up? Don't here ANYTHING about Rhodium anymore -- do not understand how such big spikes could ever happen as it did almost to 10K -- if people could have just stored the stuff for cheap. Or was everyone really so clueless, nobody thought of having any reserves?
    You can thank one bankrupt car company for that spike to 10K, alas nothing like that will ever happen again now that we have two physical rhodium ETFs. The ETFs tend to stabilize prices, and even depress them, as some investors will sell at a loss. I'm still hopeful that emission control regs in China will eventually bring demand back up. Oddly enough, according to Heraus, there has been a big increase in sales in the last few weeks at these low prices. You would think increasing sales might drive up the price, but that hasn't been the case. The Fanya metals exchange in China has collapsed due to massive corruption. One day last year I noticed the price of rhodium on the Fanya exchange was much higher than JM or BASF, and wondered how that was possible? Well now we know...

    I would say that this is actually a great buying opertunity right now given the depressed prices. The current economic slowdown in China won't last forever, but I see the upside for rhodium to be much more limited due to the ETFs.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhodium9000 View Post
    You can thank one bankrupt car company for that spike to 10K, alas nothing like that will ever happen again now that we have two physical rhodium ETFs. The ETFs tend to stabilize prices, and even depress them, as some investors will sell at a loss. I'm still hopeful that emission control regs in China will eventually bring demand back up. Oddly enough, according to Heraus, there has been a big increase in sales in the last few weeks at these low prices. You would think increasing sales might drive up the price, but that hasn't been the case. The Fanya metals exchange in China has collapsed due to massive corruption. One day last year I noticed the price of rhodium on the Fanya exchange was much higher than JM or BASF, and wondered how that was possible? Well now we know...

    I would say that this is actually a great buying opertunity right now given the depressed prices. The current economic slowdown in China won't last forever, but I see the upside for rhodium to be much more limited due to the ETFs.
    Does rhodium have more upside potential then platinum, given the ETF tempering of profit? I personally enjoy platinum more -- but if I get more positive info on Rhodium, I'll throw some in the mix (did purchase some physical rhodium over $1000/oz, which I now see as a mistake). Given the similar industrial uses of rhodium and platinum (and palladium for that matter) in catalytic converters - will the manufacturers just go with what cost less, in which case, should the choice between rhodium and platinum investment be for the one currently cheaper?
    “Of all the contrivances for cheating the laboring class of mankind, none has been more effective than that which deludes them with paper money.”Daniel Webster (1782-1852)

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by motocat View Post
    Does rhodium have more upside potential then platinum, given the ETF tempering of profit? I personally enjoy platinum more -- but if I get more positive info on Rhodium, I'll throw some in the mix (did purchase some physical rhodium over $1000/oz, which I now see as a mistake). Given the similar industrial uses of rhodium and platinum (and palladium for that matter) in catalytic converters - will the manufacturers just go with what cost less, in which case, should the choice between rhodium and platinum investment be for the one currently cheaper?
    Good question. It is possible to make a 3-way catalytic converter using only rhodium. However, currently it is not done. Can this change? Maybe, but the price of rhodium would have to remain below that of platinum for long enough for the automakers to make that change. But if they do, given their high inertia to change, any increase in the price of rhodium would be pure profit for physical rhodium holders, in my view.

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    Isn't rhodium even rarer than platinum however? I would think that would shoot the price of rhodium off the map ...again.
    You look like I need a drink.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ronbo View Post
    Isn't rhodium even rarer than platinum however? I would think that would shoot the price of rhodium off the map ...again.
    Yes it is more rare. However, it is now cheaper to obtain. If you have a choice to use the same amount of Rhodium or Platinum for a Catalytic converter -- why not go with Rhodium since it will cost you less? When Rhodium price is under Platinum, is it the better buy in light of this? Or, does Platinum use as bullion and in jewelry (although some Rhodium also used in that) justify it's higher price? (Platinum is to Rhodium as Gold is to Platinum?)
    “Of all the contrivances for cheating the laboring class of mankind, none has been more effective than that which deludes them with paper money.”Daniel Webster (1782-1852)

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by motocat View Post
    Yes it is more rare. However, it is now cheaper to obtain. If you have a choice to use the same amount of Rhodium or Platinum for a Catalytic converter -- why not go with Rhodium since it will cost you less? When Rhodium price is under Platinum, is it the better buy in light of this? Or, does Platinum use as bullion and in jewelry (although some Rhodium also used in that) justify it's higher price? (Platinum is to Rhodium as Gold is to Platinum?)
    From Heraeus:
    "Rhodium in demand despite Chinese New Year; relatively high turnovers for ruthenium and iridium busier
    Surprisingly, Rhodium has seen good buying interest during the celebrations of the Chinese New Year. In the wake of the price increase of the other metals, especially PGMs, both physical needs, and investors’ interest has risen considerably. Growing demand subsequently resulted in a slight price increase."

  10. #10

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    That's why we have landfills, great stores of metals, just waiting for a future date to be mined nothing is running out except time, time .. as we know it is definitely limited.

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