PDA

View Full Version : Am I the only one buying Pd?



QuikSilver
03-21-2007, 06:59 AM
Hello to all. This is my first post. I guess the biggest question I have is if I'm the only person around here that is actually buying Palladium? I know all the stuff about the Russians manipulating the supply and stuff like that, but as far as a long term investment I think Pd has a lot of upside. I think that in the future (10-25 years) the increased demand for fuel cells will create a major demand for Pd. From my understanding Palladium is only slightly more abundant than Platinum, and we all know how expensive Pt is.

Anyone have any thoughts on this? I'm still young (under 30) and have time, hopefully, for seriously long term investments. Is that why everyone else shies away from Pd?

Don't worry, Pd is not my only investment. Any comments would be appreciated.

Moneholio
03-21-2007, 07:26 AM
Palladium is my #2 choice.

I don't have much, though I plan to slowly accumulate more.

NutFlush
03-21-2007, 04:58 PM
No not really. Lets see I have about 8 lbs gold 8 lbs palladium and 500 lbs silver. Three quaters of my palladium is under 280 US. Im still buying palladium and silver. I was waiting for gold to hit under 600 as that is my personal resistance. I therefore have been buying silver and palladium on these dips. Palladium seems to be on its own, away from gold more than silver. That last correction, palladium held straight . I personally wouldnt buy 1 ounce of gold for 660 US when I can get an ounce of palladium at 360 US.But then again for 400 US i can almost get 300 ounces of silver . Palladium is on its way to 1000 .Once fuel cells become the norm Palladium will really shine. Look at a Rhodium chart and I expect something similar with Palladium . Maybe not 6000 per ounce but i can see Palladium at 2500 easily by 2020 . Seems far but really its only 13 years away . I love palladium as an investment . So NO your not the only one buying it. :D

Commoner
03-21-2007, 07:28 PM
I guess the biggest question I have is if I'm the only person around here that is actually buying Palladium?

Take that Pamp bar or Maple out of the plastic and put it in you hand -- other than all the industral reason to own it, feel it. It does not tarnish and it feels good.

You are not alone. View some of my other posts and give me some feedback if you would like to stimulate a dialogue.

QuikSilver
03-21-2007, 07:29 PM
I feel much better now. I guess the smaller Pd forum reflects the much smaller market.

That's a nice pile of shiny metal you've acquired. I hope I can get there in a couple of years.

Thanks for the input.

QuikSilver
03-21-2007, 07:37 PM
Commoner, I thought about taking the Maples out of the plastic, But I just couldn't bring myself to do it.

Do you have any thoughts on the idea that the Russians heavily manipulate the supply of Pd.? To me, it seems that if they were severly manipulatiing the suppy we would see much more volitility, with there being perceived shortages all the time, not just the one time in 2000.

Commoner
03-21-2007, 07:51 PM
Commoner, I thought about taking the Maples out of the plastic, But I just couldn't bring myself to do it.

Do you have any thoughts on the idea that the Russians heavily manipulate the supply of Pd.? To me, it seems that if they were severly manipulatiing the suppy we would see much more volitility, with there being perceived shortages all the time, not just the one time in 2000.

Yes, I believe that the Russians have control over Palladium. People were burned by the Russians a while back and do not forget too easily. Real demand will have to build for Palladium, and a wise manipulator will keep the price low enough to draw the market in. This will take time. The first manipulation of the market was a maturing step for Russia, they blew. But like Russian oil, they are coming into their own.

How can you resist at least taking one out of the plastic?

born2drv
03-21-2007, 11:29 PM
Pd seems to be a tough metal to trade. With kitco's pool account the spread is enormous.... costs over spot when purchasing seem relatively high as well.

Even as a jeweler I take a hit when I get stuff made in palladium because the people who cast for me claim their expenses to buy over spot are much higher and they buy less often vs gold/pt and so that they charge an extra premium for extra market fluctuations they may encounter when it comes time to buy back.

But it hasn't deterred me, I buy pamp bars for investment and PD950 alloy for my white metal jewelry stock over platinum 9 times out of 10.

Almost 2/3'rds of my bullion is now palladium bars, the rest gold and a little silver, I don't invest in platinum anymore.

NutFlush
03-22-2007, 01:29 AM
What are your reasons for buying PMs. Therefore what you purchase should determine what metal you like. If you want to store wealth get gold . Tried and true this has with held threw the ages. It is also very small compared to silver so transporting and storing is much easier. If you want to buy and hold get Palladium for the long term . Fuel cells and jewelery will have to be more abundant to draw enough demand. If you wanna run with the rebels get some silver . I see it as having the most dramatic price increase of them all . I hope anyways. And platinum if you can afford to buy, then all means get it. But i wouldnt go out of my way to hold platinum as I see palladium as much better value . At this time I find palladium undervalued. It can absorb hydrogen threw molecular absorbtion of some sort. Silver is fair price right now, gold is a bit high for me, palladium nice price range ,platinum outta my price range. At anytime you hold metal you know there is labour , energy, resource ,exloration and drilling , as well as management ,director and minting costs involved. That is all lot of stuff to get organised for that little coin and that is why its really worth something . Buy till you die

QuikSilver
03-22-2007, 05:37 AM
Pd seems to be a tough metal to trade. With kitco's pool account the spread is enormous.... costs over spot when purchasing seem relatively high as well.


In the future when (if) Pd. goes to 1-2K per Oz. I really don't care about paying a whole 22 bucks over spot. I'm not trying to make a quick buck here. On the APMEX site Palladium pamp bars are only 13.00 over the ask and Maples are 22.00 over. A gold Maple is still 13.95 over spot if you buy 20 or more. Not a major difference if you ask me.

Nutflush, I suppose my reasons for buying PM's are the same as everyone else. To store wealth/long term investment. I don't have a wife or kids, but if I ever do it would be nice to leave them something other than a pile of bills. Oh, and "buy till you die"? Isn't that the American way? I sure plan on it.

JER01
03-22-2007, 02:45 PM
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/ap/f...
Is palladium the new platinum? Jewelers in this country may balk, but for cost-conscious jewelry makers in China, the answer is increasingly yes.

The price of platinum's cheaper, lesser known cousin has risen sharply in the market over the past few years on growing demand from the industrial and investment sectors. But the silvery-white metal has recently found a new end market in China _ in jewelry, as a platinum substitute.

Palladium has seen expansive growth in the Chinese market as the cost of platinum has risen beyond the reach of the country's less affluent consumers, and market analysts expect to see additional growth this year.

"We are palladium bulls," JPMorgan analyst Steve Shepherd said in a recent report. "We would argue the potential exists for explosive growth in the fledgling palladium jewelry market _ a market which seemed to appear from nowhere three years ago, in China."

Palladium prices peaked last year at $396.50 ounce in May _ as most metals did amid sharp gains in the commodities bull market of early last year. After coming down slightly from the peak, the metal has begun its climb again in 2007.

Palladium started the year at $325 an ounce and has risen about 8 percent to $352 since then. Platinum has made a similar move, from $1,135 in January to about $1,232 currently. The two metals are coincidental; a mine of one typically produces a certain amount of the other.

Chinese demand for palladium _ like Chinese demand for nearly every commodity _ has contributed to its rapid price appreciation. In particular, the country's demand for palladium in jewelry has surged as platinum has become more expensive.

Demand for palladium in jewelry stood at about 250,000 ounces worldwide in 2003, mostly due to its use as an alloy with other metals and roughly static with where it had been for years. Then demand ballooned to 920,000 ounces in 2004. It surged again in 2005 to 1.43 million ounces.

"You've added 1 million ounces to demand in a two-year period," said HSBC analyst Victor Flores. "That is the effect of China jumping into the market."

CJS
03-22-2007, 03:06 PM
That link didn't work.
Try http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2007/03/21/ap3538356.html

QuikSilver
03-22-2007, 11:32 PM
Thanks. I think I've heard most of that stuff before. So, does anybody have any ideas why there are so few people talking about Palladium these days? Are we the only ones who realize how much upside it has in the long term? I hope not. As long as the sky doesn't fall it may be a much better investment to leave to your kids than gold.

To those who do actually have Pd, what is your favorite? Do you prefer the low cost Pamp bars or the Maples? I was considering getting one of those 10 Oz bars from APMEX, but I don't know if they come with an assay card. Also it didn't show a buy back price. Does that mean that they don't buy them back? I've never sold anything back to them. Actually, I've never sold any PM's. Does anybody (dealer) ever gripe about the purity of the bars or ask for an assay when selling a Pamp or Credit Suisse bar?

Commoner
03-23-2007, 04:04 PM
QS: The 10 oz is a little too big for me, think about when Pd is selling for 2K and you have a 20K item you may want to sell. I have both Pamp and Maples, I got the Pamps before they started minting the Maples. I just prefer coins, so my choice are Maples, no good reason for it other than trying to sell the Pamp once it has been opened – this should not be the case with Maples. I have not sold Palladium yet but I have sold gold coins and not being in a plastic bag (if that is what they came in) is not a problem at resale.

mandalisj
03-23-2007, 09:08 PM
Hello to all. This is my first post. I guess the biggest question I have is if I'm the only person around here that is actually buying Palladium? I know all the stuff about the Russians manipulating the supply and stuff like that, but as far as a long term investment I think Pd has a lot of upside. I think that in the future (10-25 years) the increased demand for fuel cells will create a major demand for Pd. From my understanding Palladium is only slightly more abundant than Platinum, and we all know how expensive Pt is.

Anyone have any thoughts on this? I'm still young (under 30) and have time, hopefully, for seriously long term investments. Is that why everyone else shies away from Pd?

Don't worry, Pd is not my only investment. Any comments would be appreciated.

you are a genius, palladium is the forgotten stepchild of the precious metals

dacrunch
03-25-2007, 02:11 PM
Hey... this would be easy to carry around... without breaking any "$10,000 export-import" rules...

$50 Canadian face value on a very-recent-date coin worth over $350 US:

http://www.nwtmintbullion.com/images/mapleleaf_palladium_obv.jpg

So... you could "technically" travel with $12k "Canadian face value" in your carry-on, no questions asked... though it would be worth ... lessee... about $84k US...

QuikSilver
03-25-2007, 03:56 PM
I see you took it out of the plastic wrapper. I guess I'm the only one who won't do it.

Actually the Canadian Palladium, Platinum, and Gold maple leafs all have a face value of 50 Canadian Dollars.

For the sake of being a nerd, The 10K reporting limit is in U.S. Dollars so, that would be about 11,600 Canadian Dollars or 232 platinum maple leafs or about 278K U.S. Dollars when you convert it back to cash in Zurich (nice city).

How's that for nerdy? :p

dacrunch
03-25-2007, 04:34 PM
I see you took it out of the plastic wrapper. I guess I'm the only one who won't do it.

Actually the Canadian Palladium, Platinum, and Gold maple leafs all have a face value of 50 Canadian Dollars.

For the sake of being a nerd, The 10K reporting limit is in U.S. Dollars so, that would be about 11,600 Canadian Dollars or 232 platinum maple leafs or about 278K U.S. Dollars when you convert it back to cash in Zurich (nice city).

How's that for nerdy? :p


okay- I was refering to the palladium ones... platinum is the ticket for that transaction :) - oh, and the picture is from nwtmint... nice pictures there ;)

Kiwi_Envoy
04-06-2007, 04:52 AM
I bought Palladium yesterday for the 1st time after looking at 2 troubling news items.

1st was a story on the box about the big Russian Palladium paladium smelter that causes acid rain galore...there are no trees at all within a very large radius and children are getting sick from living near the smelter. This as sad as it is is bullish for the metal.

2nd is Ding Dong Mugabe in 2000% inflation wrecked Zimbabwe who controls much of the Platinum market.

The 2 metals do similar catalytic things but Platinum is better from my limited knowledge, however Palladium is much cheaper.

Me wants to buy some more.

oasis
04-06-2007, 06:26 PM
I was at my coin dealer yesterday and we discussed palladium a little bit. He recommended avoiding it altogether, thought that gold and silver were both better long term investments. Besides, I'd have to pay 6% GST on any palladium maples. :(

ChainSawDave
04-07-2007, 05:47 PM
Hello to all. This is my first post. I guess the biggest question I have is if I'm the only person around here that is actually buying Palladium? I know all the stuff about the Russians manipulating the supply and stuff like that, but as far as a long term investment I think Pd has a lot of upside. I think that in the future (10-25 years) the increased demand for fuel cells will create a major demand for Pd. From my understanding Palladium is only slightly more abundant than Platinum, and we all know how expensive Pt is.

Anyone have any thoughts on this? I'm still young (under 30) and have time, hopefully, for seriously long term investments. Is that why everyone else shies away from Pd?

Don't worry, Pd is not my only investment. Any comments would be appreciated.

I don't buy palladium because I know nothing about it, it's a thin market, whom would I sell too { imagine an add on e'bay > Palladium for sale }

and hasn't it already gone up huge in recent years ?

I'll be reading your posts to 'educate' myself a little.

mandalisj
04-07-2007, 07:53 PM
just like futures pit they will let you in but not necessarily let you out ...

this is why warehouse receipts are the best deal if you have any real money, you have physical that is yours, it is insured, and you can quickly convert it back into cash ...

you can have a bunch of physical buried in your back yard, but what if you need money one day? what will you do, get raped by the dealers and pay collectible taxes? for anyone putting more than a million into precious metals this won't work ...

Figment
04-11-2007, 01:28 PM
palladium,
was , maybe 2 years ago, suppose to replace plat, in veh, cat, converters,, I don't spect that to happen,,,

just yesterday, I saw that these global warming sexperts, are saying that the pine forest of europe, and canada, are the cause of global warming, ( supposdly draining the energy of the sun ) and if those ancient pine forest were cut to teh ground ,, global warming would be stopped

what a guey frenchmen !! just a sick play on the masses,

Pm's